Every enemy pod on a trapped mission has the Call for Reinforcements ability which normally only a Command Pod gets. Thus, once the shooting starts, all the numerous aliens on the map will be rapidly converging on XCOM's position; a weaker squad can easily find itself overwhelmed.
For sure, and on tight maps, this can be absolutely fatal. We've all experienced the "clown car" of a landed Small. It's one reason why, if possible, I go for shoot-downs for smaller UFOs unless I need the power sources, as crashed UFO are never traps. I pretty much assume any landed UFO by mid-game is a trap, and I'm not ashamed to fall back to evac position if I see aliens that should not normally appear that month as it's a good indicator of a trap. Also, am I the only one who will *always* skip a landed Riperian transport (barring possibly the first one)?
I haven't bothered memorizing the transport map types but maybe I should. I can't stand the sound of that damn creek, as I nervously move from no cover, to pitiful cover, then back to no cover.
God, yes. I remember watching beagle's live early transport mission years ago, he was pretty funny as he was musing out loud "Oh, the risk. Oh, the reward. But oh, the risk...." Yeah, I know it can be done, we probably both have, with a likely need of smoke as you try to get to that crappy (and destructable!) half cover, but I really now think the reward isn't worth the risk (and the potential deep damage to your A-squad capacity that you will find yourself needing at the most inconvenient of times *right after, always* with an unexpected Council mission). The forest transport, sure, at least that has some decent cover. Not the riparian.
Sidenote: I don’t remember seeing this paragraph from looking at this page previously, so either I just overlooked it before (definitely possible) or it was added to the page in the past 6 months or so.
Interesting. I have played quite a few campaigns and never had a battle scanner activate a roving (or stationary) unactivated pod. If not a bug, I am wondering if what you experienced is some parallel mechanic. For example they definitely know where a concealed scout in sight range is, they just can't attack until the stealth is broken in a flank, which they will move to do. Did you perhaps have concealed scout nearby? As for ITT... I don't use the Second Wave option, but as you say it is active anyways in ABA (and Gangplank for the boss disk, if you play it), but my experience is that LR does protect against ITT (although as soon as it's available, I also equip the scout with a Chameleon Suit, making subsequent shots also much more likely to miss on activation) - hence I always start move with a Low Profile scout moving into a position as a half-move, allowing the rest of the squad to move into whatever positions provide cover while counterattacking. As always, thanks for continuing to share your experience and thoughts.
I never use concealed scouts, so that's not it. My impression is that it happens far more often to me than to other players, but can't really be sure. I do throw a lot of battle scanners and have in the past tried to place them as far as possible so that I can see as much as possible. Not doing that any more.
Are you sure about Lightning Reflexes working? I had a scout activate a pod on my last campaign, and didn't see the "lightning reflexes" text come up, and the shot occurs after the scout made it to cover. She wasn't hit, but it made me wonder, so I googled around and saw some comments that LR does not work on ITT.
You may be right, as the scout I always use in those cases will have Low Profile, and if it's calculated simply as a normal attack in the moved-to position, well of course the scout would have "high" cover bonus, which might what have enabled the miss. Certainly, the general internet consensus from back in the day does seem to favour your observation.
I am fascinated by your no-concealment scout preference. I find them invaluable in getting off a sniper "alpha strike" for a couple of turns on long maps, thinning out a tough pod (particularly floaters in early game, who often don't take cover, and can be murdered with flak ammo). Without concealment, I can see why you use so many battle scanners. But as they are on different perk tiers, why not have both? A scout can move to concealment, spot a pod, and throw a scanner which counters either the pod moving back out of visual range, or (since, as we know, the aliens *do* know where that scout is and will try to flank if they can) prepare to move back before that happens. Nothing is so disappointing as throwing a valuable battle scanner and finding nothing - this saves those precious little gems for when you really need it (e.g. early seekers). Admittedly, it's only *really* useful on roadway-type maps, or vast landed / crashed maps. But, since a meld canister is high cover, it can be quite nice to spot one and double move / conceal to it for guaranteed safe recovery on the next turn, and I'd never risk a double move into fog otherwise.
I tried Concealment a long time ago, and didn't like it, but I didn't really know what I was doing, so maybe I should give it another go. I have considered it, but keep imagining this scenario - I move a concealed scout into a forward position, that has vision of 2-3 enemy pods. The Scout is then stuck there. Then one of those pods (seekers, perhaps) patrols towards my squad, activates, then charges forward, revealing the Scout, which then triggers the other pod(s).
Another reason I haven't tried sooner is because Hit& Run is amazing. Also I was using my Scouts as officers up until the most recent campaign when I switched to Medic Officers. Didn't even consider Concealment Officers, but maybe that is a thing.
You're right, and I have had that exact "pinned" scenario happen to me several times. Most often though in the crazy late-game terror missions, where you might have two (or ALL in one of my more ridiculous experiences) pods walk into you while you are engaged, and that first-concealment move to save a token one civilian might be all you get :-). In my experience, it can be worth having to deal with two (or at most, three) pods if you need a turn's prep time, either if you're the type to go Archer MEC and want to preposition Proximity Mines at probable alien cover points, or to put an ITZ sniper into the air with Archangel, or to drop Combat Drugs smoke or Psi Inspiration if one of those pods contains an Etherial, where one pod or three, you're still going to have a bad time. I kind of wonder if it would be worth using Stealth Armor, because then a concealed scout can still disengage without activating any of the pods, but scouts are already too squishy.
I do find an HnR Scout or two in my roster *is* the preferred swap-in on the tight maps (bank, particularly for bomb disposal or Zhang cemetery both come to mind), or anywhere you know you're going to have to charge to get out of a crappy LZ. But I tend to prefer Assaults for my HnR duties..
I believe the "Hunt Protocol will occasionally happen for no clear reason." section is because those are trapped UFOs
From https://www.ufopaedia.org/index.php/Threat_(Long_War) :
Every enemy pod on a trapped mission has the Call for Reinforcements ability which normally only a Command Pod gets. Thus, once the shooting starts, all the numerous aliens on the map will be rapidly converging on XCOM's position; a weaker squad can easily find itself overwhelmed.
For sure, and on tight maps, this can be absolutely fatal. We've all experienced the "clown car" of a landed Small. It's one reason why, if possible, I go for shoot-downs for smaller UFOs unless I need the power sources, as crashed UFO are never traps. I pretty much assume any landed UFO by mid-game is a trap, and I'm not ashamed to fall back to evac position if I see aliens that should not normally appear that month as it's a good indicator of a trap. Also, am I the only one who will *always* skip a landed Riperian transport (barring possibly the first one)?
I haven't bothered memorizing the transport map types but maybe I should. I can't stand the sound of that damn creek, as I nervously move from no cover, to pitiful cover, then back to no cover.
God, yes. I remember watching beagle's live early transport mission years ago, he was pretty funny as he was musing out loud "Oh, the risk. Oh, the reward. But oh, the risk...." Yeah, I know it can be done, we probably both have, with a likely need of smoke as you try to get to that crappy (and destructable!) half cover, but I really now think the reward isn't worth the risk (and the potential deep damage to your A-squad capacity that you will find yourself needing at the most inconvenient of times *right after, always* with an unexpected Council mission). The forest transport, sure, at least that has some decent cover. Not the riparian.
Sidenote: I don’t remember seeing this paragraph from looking at this page previously, so either I just overlooked it before (definitely possible) or it was added to the page in the past 6 months or so.
I have noticed some changes to the ufopaedia, and also have never seen that text.
Thanks for finding this - it sounds very plausible. Will revise the post.
Oh, apparently you can just click the "View history" tab at the top of the page and see the edits. I've never tried that on a wiki before tbh.
18:26, 18 April 2025 J2Greene talk contribs m 4,457 bytes +340 Call for Reinforcements on trapped UFOs
Shoutouts to J2Greene!
Interesting. I have played quite a few campaigns and never had a battle scanner activate a roving (or stationary) unactivated pod. If not a bug, I am wondering if what you experienced is some parallel mechanic. For example they definitely know where a concealed scout in sight range is, they just can't attack until the stealth is broken in a flank, which they will move to do. Did you perhaps have concealed scout nearby? As for ITT... I don't use the Second Wave option, but as you say it is active anyways in ABA (and Gangplank for the boss disk, if you play it), but my experience is that LR does protect against ITT (although as soon as it's available, I also equip the scout with a Chameleon Suit, making subsequent shots also much more likely to miss on activation) - hence I always start move with a Low Profile scout moving into a position as a half-move, allowing the rest of the squad to move into whatever positions provide cover while counterattacking. As always, thanks for continuing to share your experience and thoughts.
I stand corrected. I just now threw a battle scanner and activated a pod of seekers + cyberdisk. I have never seen that before now.
I never use concealed scouts, so that's not it. My impression is that it happens far more often to me than to other players, but can't really be sure. I do throw a lot of battle scanners and have in the past tried to place them as far as possible so that I can see as much as possible. Not doing that any more.
Are you sure about Lightning Reflexes working? I had a scout activate a pod on my last campaign, and didn't see the "lightning reflexes" text come up, and the shot occurs after the scout made it to cover. She wasn't hit, but it made me wonder, so I googled around and saw some comments that LR does not work on ITT.
You may be right, as the scout I always use in those cases will have Low Profile, and if it's calculated simply as a normal attack in the moved-to position, well of course the scout would have "high" cover bonus, which might what have enabled the miss. Certainly, the general internet consensus from back in the day does seem to favour your observation.
I am fascinated by your no-concealment scout preference. I find them invaluable in getting off a sniper "alpha strike" for a couple of turns on long maps, thinning out a tough pod (particularly floaters in early game, who often don't take cover, and can be murdered with flak ammo). Without concealment, I can see why you use so many battle scanners. But as they are on different perk tiers, why not have both? A scout can move to concealment, spot a pod, and throw a scanner which counters either the pod moving back out of visual range, or (since, as we know, the aliens *do* know where that scout is and will try to flank if they can) prepare to move back before that happens. Nothing is so disappointing as throwing a valuable battle scanner and finding nothing - this saves those precious little gems for when you really need it (e.g. early seekers). Admittedly, it's only *really* useful on roadway-type maps, or vast landed / crashed maps. But, since a meld canister is high cover, it can be quite nice to spot one and double move / conceal to it for guaranteed safe recovery on the next turn, and I'd never risk a double move into fog otherwise.
I tried Concealment a long time ago, and didn't like it, but I didn't really know what I was doing, so maybe I should give it another go. I have considered it, but keep imagining this scenario - I move a concealed scout into a forward position, that has vision of 2-3 enemy pods. The Scout is then stuck there. Then one of those pods (seekers, perhaps) patrols towards my squad, activates, then charges forward, revealing the Scout, which then triggers the other pod(s).
Another reason I haven't tried sooner is because Hit& Run is amazing. Also I was using my Scouts as officers up until the most recent campaign when I switched to Medic Officers. Didn't even consider Concealment Officers, but maybe that is a thing.
You're right, and I have had that exact "pinned" scenario happen to me several times. Most often though in the crazy late-game terror missions, where you might have two (or ALL in one of my more ridiculous experiences) pods walk into you while you are engaged, and that first-concealment move to save a token one civilian might be all you get :-). In my experience, it can be worth having to deal with two (or at most, three) pods if you need a turn's prep time, either if you're the type to go Archer MEC and want to preposition Proximity Mines at probable alien cover points, or to put an ITZ sniper into the air with Archangel, or to drop Combat Drugs smoke or Psi Inspiration if one of those pods contains an Etherial, where one pod or three, you're still going to have a bad time. I kind of wonder if it would be worth using Stealth Armor, because then a concealed scout can still disengage without activating any of the pods, but scouts are already too squishy.
I do find an HnR Scout or two in my roster *is* the preferred swap-in on the tight maps (bank, particularly for bomb disposal or Zhang cemetery both come to mind), or anywhere you know you're going to have to charge to get out of a crappy LZ. But I tend to prefer Assaults for my HnR duties..